Final Cut Express 2.0 doesn't support 24fps

[xander76]

For those of you who didn't see it, Apple released Final Cut Express 2.0 today for $299. Looking at the feature list, it looks like FCE2 is based on FCP4 (as ppposed to FCE1, which was based on FCP3). However, 24fps editing and advanced pulldown are two features that are only available in FCP, so most DVX owners will still do best with FCP rather than FCE. While I understand Apple's desire to charge a premium for film and "film-style" editing, it's unfortunate.

For a more thorough comparison of features, check out http://www.apple.com/finalcut/.

[magicdavek]

Check out this thread on the same topic.

http://www.dvxuser.com/cgi-bin/DVX/YaBB.cgi?board=FCP;action=display;num=1072068118

While your post is accurate, it may be a bit misleading to DVX100 users who are potential Express buyers. Because the pulldown from 60i to 24p goes on in the camera, the DVX100 outputs at the standard 29.97 fps, as if the material was shot on 60i. So Final Cut Express can work fine with DVX output so long as once dumped into the computer, you plan on editing within a 29.97 timeline and plan to go back to tape that way. If I am correct, then, DVX100 users who have no need to use a 24 fps time line nor need to remove the advanced pulldown done in the DVX, then Express should work fine. But the DVX100's output is not (in my understanding) native 24p, so the fact that the line on Apple's site that Express doesn't have 24fps editing should not scare away DVX users. Final Cut Pro is also appealing to filmmakers who need to edit in native 24fps. The DVX is not film. It outputs video, and Final Cut will treat it like video and yet it will look like film.

Does this all make sense? I'd hate to think that people are spending and extra $700 on Final Cut Pro when they may never need the missing features as it relates to shooting with the DVX100's 24p mode.

Remember, your 24p mode in your DVX looks like film. But it is being output as video, so Express can handle it. So long as you don't need to remove the advanced pulldown or do native 24fps editing with DVX footage, then Express should be a fine alternative. However, in the other thread, Dashwood warns not to edit on a pulled down frame (I presume because of the fact that, especially at a scene change, you'll get two very different looking fields in the same frame which the eye could catch as a blip-but I suspect in clips without too much action, and adacent frames look pretty similar, you should't have much trouble).

Please correct me if I'm wrong and I know none of you will hesitate to do so!

[xander76]

True, you can edit 24pn footage on a 60i timeline in Final Cut Express, and I should have been more clear about that. I have to admit that I'm biased against the 24p acquisition and 60i editing workflow, although I have no real data to support that bias. I might do some tests where I cut on the C frame of a 24p pulldown to see just how it looks. I'm also interested in what a cross-dissolve would look like if the two 24p sources' pulldowns weren't in lock. If I do those tests, I'll post my impressions here.

If anyone else has done those tests, what do you think about the look?

[xander76]

I did a small test with some 24pn footage edited at 60i yesterday. I took some footage with a moderate amount of motion and cut it together with the pulldown cadence off in the following ways:

1) I cut two shots together so that the outgoing shot ended on the 4th frame of the pulldown (the C-D frame) and the incoming shot started on the 3rd frame of the pulldown (the B-C frame).

2) I did a cross dissolve where the two clips were lined up so that their cadences were off by two frames. This meant that almost every frame in the final composite had at least one frame that was interlaced (either the B-C frame or the C-D frame).

In both cases, I couldn't see anything wrong with the final product. I didn't notice the cadence changing at all. Based on this, I would say that it's not that bad to edit 24pn footage at 60i. Clearly, it would be a bad idea if you wanted to do a film out, a 24p DVD, or a 24p quicktime. If you are sure that you won't be needing those formats, though, it seems fine to me.