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View Full Version : Robin the Spy: Need reviews of the new edit!



Michael Anthony Horrigan
06-11-2007, 08:45 AM
NEW EDIT (http://www.morecowbellpictures.com/downloads/new_edit_for_leo.wmv)

I really need your advice! Does this new edit work?
Please watch the middle and final act.

I want to get this right before Leo finishes the score.
There is no music at all in this edit so it will seem a little plain.

Opinions needed!

Thanks,

Mike

Matt Sconce
06-11-2007, 09:43 AM
I will watch and comment soon. Downloading now.

Hootzie
06-11-2007, 10:13 AM
Roger that, my hard rockin amigo!

cinealma
06-11-2007, 10:17 AM
Just finished downloading and starting to watch now.

Michael Anthony Horrigan
06-11-2007, 10:26 AM
Thanks guys! This is really a great group....

Cheers,

Mike

Karl151k
06-11-2007, 10:28 AM
http://www.footnotetv.com/picftvsouthpark907.jpgWow, what a terrific audience.

Hootzie
06-11-2007, 10:32 AM
I enjoyed this version much better. Story flowed and really ended strong. Can't wait to see it with music! GO TEAM!

cinealma
06-11-2007, 10:33 AM
Mike:

Glad you cut out the whole gadget scene. I think it works SO MUCH BETTER! So, just a few "this is what I would do" things. Take 'em or leave 'em.

1. The church scene needs to be tightened up. It drags just a little, I think mainly when the female actor speaks her lines. Edit her dialogue to speed her up a bit. And I think it would be cool to make her an equal. So cut out the piece of dialogue where she addresses him as "sir".

1b. At the end of the church scene, don't hold so long on him after making the sign of the cross and wincing.

2. Cut directly from the "not Robin" out of the church to Robin's face emerging from behind the column/wall/statue or whatever.

3. I like the use of flashback/memory for the gadgets, but we need to see Robin thinking about it. A quick CU of Robin before showing the cards, the watch, will help motivate the flashbacks.

3b. The cards, show the gadget girl. The watch, either just use VO for her or superimpose her over the main scene.

4. I like the inclusion of the "back at the office" scene. But I think you need to reveal the pen earlier in the piece. Maybe you can put the flashback of the pen in the other Agent's head when he's at the church with the pen in the bible (or was it a hymnal). I don't think the flashback in the office scene works too well, I think it kills the pace.

5. Don't kill them all. As a viewer, I want to come out thinking, "Oh my God, what adventure/trouble will Agent Robin get into next?" Have him go for the pen, the other agents saying "Nooooo..." and end it.


Just my two cents. I would LOVE to see this thing uncompressed. I think the photograhy looks amazing.

Thanks for sharing.

Michael Anthony Horrigan
06-11-2007, 11:01 AM
Thanks guys! Much appreciated...

John, I'll try to address your points.

1. I agree that the church scene does drag a tad... I may tighten it up a bit more.

2. I'll take a look at that, it might be a beat too long.

3. I'm not sure if I have those shots. I'll take a look. I've also added a typical "whoosh!" effect with the coinciding flashbacks in my newer edit.

3.b. I thought just the voice-over might be too confusing...

4. I'm not sure If that will work. I'll try something though...

5. I know it's a nerve gas but I think they are just unconscious, not dead. :)

Great advice all around! I really want to thank everyone on here, I really feel that this has improved thanks to many of the suggestions I have received.

Thanks again!

Keep them coming...


Cheers,

Mike

leogardini
06-11-2007, 11:55 AM
Here I go:Drogar-Happy(DBG):...this topic is happening because I suggested Mike not to delete the second scene...I thank him for considering my suggestion in showing the new version before I start to compose the new soundtrack!!!
Here is my two cents:I think the second scene (the girl showing Robin the equipment) was very important mainly for the fact of presenting the main character (Robin) before he takes action in the story...this is crucial because we start to know him and his main features before the climax!!!
To me, the scene shouldn´t also be deleted because the small slices showed in this new edition makes no sence since we´ve never seen the girl before...it makes me wonder "what´s this girl doing in the midle of the scene???""Is he remembering something???If so, remembering what???I haven´t seen it before"...to me the story in this way is not being told very clearly!!!
Anyway, as I said to Mike...we should watch the movie as it was the first time and not having in mind the deleted scene...does anyone share the same point of view???I think I´m alone:Drogar-Shock(DBG):!!!

cinealma
06-11-2007, 12:34 PM
Here I go:Drogar-Happy(DBG):...this topic is happening because I suggested Mike not to delete the second scene...I thank him for considering my suggestion in showing the new version before I start to compose the new soundtrack!!!
Here is my two cents:I think the second scene (the girl showing Robin the equipment) was very important mainly for the fact of presenting the main character (Robin) before he takes action in the story...this is crucial because we start to know him and his main features before the climax!!!
To me, the scene shouldn´t also be deleted because the small slices showed in this new edition makes no sence since we´ve never seen the girl before...it makes me wonder "what´s this girl doing in the midle of the scene???""Is he remembering something???If so, remembering what???I haven´t seen it before"...to me the story in this way is not being told very clearly!!!
Anyway, as I said to Mike...we should watch the movie as it was the first time and not having in mind the deleted scene...does anyone share the same point of view???I think I´m alone:Drogar-Shock(DBG):!!!

From reading reviews, feedback, etc., I think we all agree that the "gadget scene" is the weakest of the film on a technical level, ALTHOUGH I think working it out in post can solve most of it's challenges.

For me, in the SpyFest cut, it kind of feels out of place, like it was just cut in there.

But I might have a solution: why not put that scene up front? That way, you establish the hero in the beginning. When we get to the church, we can relate to what the agent is feeling when it's "Oh, no, not Agent Robin".

It's hard to establish character in a 6 minute short. It seems like you have enough material to make it longer, so I say definitely go for it. And I think maybe putting the "gadget scene" as scene #1 helps us to identify with the main character and could drive the film better.

Just an idea.

Hootzie
06-11-2007, 01:52 PM
Good idea cinealma! I never would have thought of that! I'd roll that idea out and see how it plays.

insanityfw
06-11-2007, 02:07 PM
But I might have a solution: why not put that scene up front? That way, you establish the hero in the beginning. When we get to the church, we can relate to what the agent is feeling when it's "Oh, no, not Agent Robin".

It's hard to establish character in a 6 minute short. It seems like you have enough material to make it longer, so I say definitely go for it. And I think maybe putting the "gadget scene" as scene #1 helps us to identify with the main character and could drive the film better.

Just an idea.

I think it was the weakest technically, but was still needed. In a longer piece it would have been a must-have element. It would be nice if there were a bunch of close ups of the girl talking so that the scene might be paced a little quicker.

I think Cinealma might be onto something by putting it up front. Definitely worth a try.

Keep it going or step away for few more days and try not to think about it, then come back at it "fresh".

cinealma
06-11-2007, 02:12 PM
... step away for few more days and try not to think about it, then come back at it "fresh".

Best advice by far!

Michael Anthony Horrigan
06-11-2007, 02:12 PM
What I'm going to do is run it by a few friends who have never seen either version. If they don't get the flashbacks... I'll definitely rethink the edit.

If they get it, then I'll be happy to leave it as is.

I have a couple of movie buffs in mind.

I'll let you know.

Leo, once again... thanks for all your help!

Michael Anthony Horrigan
06-11-2007, 05:27 PM
If you are going to look at the new edit please do so here!

NEW EDIT (http://www.morecowbellpictures.com/downloads/new_rts_edit.mov)

Here is a nicer looking H.264 movie of the new edit, with the original score, some extra sound effect work, and one minor edit change.

Cheers!

I would edit the original post but it won't let me.

I'm going to show this one to a few people who have never seen the original and see how it goes over.

Thanks,

Mike

John LaBonney
06-12-2007, 12:40 AM
Mike:

Just watched the new cut. Both my wife (who is impossible to please at times) and I thought it was a big improvement using the footage that you captured during production. I was especially glad to see the end scene back in the film.

I think it's a good idea to show it to people who haven't seen the festival entry version to get their impression. It's difficult for me to separate them myself, so I imagine that you, having been so close to it for so long, must have a really tough time getting some perspective on it.

John

Michael Anthony Horrigan
06-12-2007, 05:27 AM
Mike:

Just watched the new cut. Both my wife (who is impossible to please at times) and I thought it was a big improvement using the footage that you captured during production. I was especially glad to see the end scene back in the film.


Awesome! Glad you liked it.

I'm still going to show it around to unsuspecting individuals soon. :)

I'll let you know how it goes.

PS- If you hear of any festivals I might be able to enter it in just drop me a line.

Thanks,

Mike